Post by: JonLeung on March 27, 2008, 07:19:31 pm
Looks neat. I bought a Street Fighter art book (Eternal Challenge, I think) a while back. But this looks cooler.
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 27, 2008, 07:59:57 pm
---
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Current projects: Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man V (GB), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: marioman on March 27, 2008, 08:59:51 pm
Post by: Rew on March 28, 2008, 07:18:28 am
---
"So this is what it's like..."
- Spark Mandrill
Post by: marioman on March 28, 2008, 07:23:19 am
Post by: JonLeung on March 28, 2008, 12:04:51 pm
Dangit, why don't these things come out in English? I can't read Japanese. =(
And if it was only in Japanese, would you appreciate the art less? :P
(I suppose you'd miss out on some descriptions of what things are...but for the most part I don't think it'd be too bad.)
Post by: Rew on March 28, 2008, 10:42:15 pm
@Jon: You make a good point there. Still, I hear that there's all sorts of valuable storyline info about MM canon in these type books that we English-speaking folk don't see unless we happen to be on a MM forum with an uber MM nerd who knows Japanese and has these kinds of sourcebooks to cite in debate threads. =P
---
"So this is what it's like..."
- Spark Mandrill
Post by: JonLeung on March 29, 2008, 02:09:51 pm
Seriously, this is all you need to know:
MM: It's Dr. Wily. Again.
MMX: Zero dies in every other game. And look, it's Sigma. Again.
I'm sure if it hasn't been mentioned (possible spoiler?) that the Sigma Virus will turn out to be Wily's soul, so technically it has always been Wily. :P I'm totally guessing here but I wouldn't be surprised.
I kid, though. There are some convolutions in the storyline in other regards in the MMX games, though sadly they haven't been all that memorable. It's, like, look, Bamboo Pandemonium, I don't particularly care about your space rocket fetish, I just want your Green Spinner so I can move on. And then all that Zero Virus/Sigma Virus stuff. Look, let's just mix in some Resident Evil T-Viruses while we're at it.
I do, however, recommend Mega Man X: Command Mission. That was that Mega Man X RPG on the GameCube and PlayStation 2. It sure is a breath of fresh air to change the genre. All those eight billion people that complain Mega Man is stale have to play that game before complaining again. You can't say Capcom doesn't change when you don't support them when they do try new things. Those same people should pick up some Killer7 while they're at it, even if Capcom was only the publisher.
Also, I want to know if it's spelled "Mega Man X2" (no space) or "Mega Man X 2" (with a space). "Mega Man X 2" makes more sense to me...after all, you don't stick other sequel numbers right to the name (and Killer7 is not a sequel, BTW). "X 2" implies a sequel to the first in the X series, which is distinct enough from the original Mega Man. If it wasn't, then I could understand "X2" as being another entry in the Mega Man series, which it is, but also isn't, since X is separate enough. It's 100 years later with different characters! They even refer to Mega Man X more commonly as X, regardless of whether or not he was built from the original Mega Man!...ramble ramble words words words :P
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 29, 2008, 02:26:10 pm
The X series might have had an interesting story if Capcom didn't change it every game or so, without mentioning outright retcons (first the Mavericks were due to the Reploids being imperfect copies of X, then it was due to the Sigma/Zero Virus, and now Maverick Hunter X seems to go back to the first idea).
That's why I prefer Mega Man Zero's story. The first one eventually got retconned after they decided that Zero didn't put himself in stasis for centuries at the end of X5, but all in all it remains my favourite because it mostly stands complete in itself.
But seriously, I think a huge Mega Man/Rock Man encyclopedia covering all the games and how they relate to one another would be really interesting. Might not sell all that much though, but a guy can dream :)
---
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Current projects: Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man V (GB), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: marioman on March 29, 2008, 03:03:57 pm
Also, I want to know if it's spelled "Mega Man X2" (no space) or "Mega Man X 2" (with a space).
No space. If you look at the title screens for the games, the number is always directly beside of the X. Also, in the Mega Man X Collection, the text on the game select menu says X2, X3, X4, etc.
Post by: JonLeung on March 29, 2008, 03:41:19 pm
And I still say the space makes more logical sense... :P
Then there's "Mega Man", clearly two words in the early games, but in the later games, appear to be one word! Arrrghghrghrble!
It's typically easier to say than to write such (apparently tricky) names. But, boy, did it irk me every time someone said "Final Fantasy ECKS TWO" when anyone can clearly see it's "Final Fantasy TEN-TWO". Blargg! BLARGG!
Anyway, back on topic...I remember Keiji Inafune (I think that's his name) mentioning on that one G4 clip I saw on Mega Man X Anniversary Collection (GameCube version) how if someone presented art of the same quality of the art that he himself had done for the first Mega Man, he would've said, "nope, sorry, try again". It's funny how with each Mega Man game, the detail of the Robot Masters goes up. There's not a huge distinction between two games right next to each other, but after a few, and it's like, whoa. I wonder if I still have that folder on my hard drive when I was trying to collect official art of every Robot Master...
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 29, 2008, 04:03:34 pm
I also noticed that about the Robot Masters' designs. In the first game, everyone looks pretty much as simplistic as Mega Man himself, which makes sense since they're all creations of Dr Light. But beginning with the second one, you can already see that they're all more detailled and more customized for their respective functions and environments.
I'd say that the only generation of Robot Masters I didn't like was the one from Mega Man VII. But then again, I wasn't a fan of that game's graphical style so that might be a reason. I much preferred the style in Mega Man 8 and Mega Man & Bass, even if they made Proto Man taller than Mega Man despite being his prototype (it might be a simple issue of posture though, since Blues stands tall and defiant unlike Rock).
(Yes, I do know I tend to switch between the American and Japanese names).
I've often wondered how cool it would be to see official sprite conversions for all the Robot Masters and characters (1 through 8, plus Mega Man & Bass as well as the Rockman Killers from the Game Boy games) both in standard NES graphics and in my favourite Mega Man 8 style. Heck, for all the 8 bit ones, even try and redo them to increase details and expressiveness since the Masters from the first game don't really look good anymore (and Guts Man looks like a stocky hunchback).
There used to be a site called the Robot Center I think which had sprite artists do Mega Man VII styled sprites of the NES bosses, but the site vanished a few years back I think.
---
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Current projects: Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man V (GB), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: marioman on March 29, 2008, 04:05:07 pm
At least Mega Man X makes more sense than that. I think that the intent of using X2 is to keep people from calling it Mega Man Ten-Two. (I personally remember hearing people refer to MMX as Mega Man Ten, but that stopped after X2 came out.)
Post by: JonLeung on March 29, 2008, 04:19:12 pm
But where's Mega Man IX, then? Even if you consider Mega Man & Bass to be 9/IX, then where's 11/Eleven/XI/X1? There isn't, it goes from X (not ten) to X 2 (not twelve). Then if you actually play the game and realize it's 100 years later and Wily's not around and there's Sigma instead and there's different issues and the tone of the games are different...
I thought it was a sad, sad day when Penny Arcade revealed their ignorance by having a comic where Tycho was growing furious trying to explain to Gabe that Mega Man X meant Mega Man 10 when it absolutely isn't. If there's one thing I hate more than people being wrong, it's people being so sure they're right about it. And if there's one thing I hate more about people being so sure about being right when they're wrong, is when they're published making that incorrect point.
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 29, 2008, 04:30:12 pm
---
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Current projects: Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man V (GB), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: marioman on March 29, 2008, 04:32:13 pm
And the people who say that Mega Man X2 is Mega Man 12 need to go back to school. (Or at least figure out the difference between Arabic and Roman numerals.)
Post by: JonLeung on March 29, 2008, 04:39:09 pm
Clearly wrong, other fans did send in emails to correct them, and if you read the whole news post that day, they did eventually get it figured out. I guess they aren't the biggest Mega Man fans, but seeing as how Mega Man is in more games than Super Mario, you would think that such a fact should be elementary for people such as themselves. Oh, well, everyone makes mistakes sometimes, and maybe I'm no better for holding them to this one.
I guess we've gone so far off-topic but I'd like to slap everyone who thinks "Game Boy" is one word, where, unlike the confusion that is "Mega Man", "Game Boy" has never been one word and has always been two. I'm sure I've mentioned being irked by that countless times before. I guess I'm more visually-oriented than people, that at times I feel as if people are blind to that space being there even though what's really happening is that they're probably hearing the words together all the time more than seeing them just slightly apart. I still dislike those times when people were so adamant that it was one word, even with an absolute lack of evidence and plenty to the contrary.
Boy, maybe I just need to lighten up.
I guess I derailed this thread just by questioning the space between the X and the number. I should get back to finishing Mega Man X 8 and even finding Mega Man X 7. When will Capcom hit Mega Man 9 or Mega Man X 9? At the rate Mega Man: Battle Network is going they'll hit 9 soon, if Star Force hasn't taken over. But maybe it'll stop at 8 too. Maybe Capcom just can't count. How many Street Fighter IIs were there before they finally moved on to III?
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 29, 2008, 04:55:32 pm
I guess we've gone so far off-topic but I'd like to slap everyone who thinks "Game Boy" is two words, where, unlike the confusion that is "Mega Man", "Game Boy" has never been one word.
So, you're angry at people who think it's two words, when in reality it's two words? Me thinks you worded that wrong :P
---
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Current projects: Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man V (GB), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: JonLeung on March 29, 2008, 04:57:34 pm
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 29, 2008, 05:02:02 pm
---
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Current projects: Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man V (GB), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: Rew on March 29, 2008, 07:26:15 pm
Ever since I was in middle school, the original MMX on Super NES had reigned as my favorite Mega Man game of all time. That remained true as I played every game in the X series. However, this past January, I finally got to Command Mission for the first time--and it dethroned X1 for the first time in 13 years. I *love* that game! (The irony, of course, is that the first time I ever saw that game in a game store, my first thought was, "Mega Man? X? As an *RPG*?" And I nearly gagged. Little did I know it would become my fave. =D
---
"So this is what it's like..."
- Spark Mandrill
Post by: JonLeung on March 30, 2008, 07:33:55 am
For example, I've tried to get into the Battle Network series without much luck. I did enjoy some episodes of the anime, but the only game I played through was Network Transmission, the platformer on the GameCube. Maybe I don't like the card-battling formula (I do love Baten Kaitos, so maybe I just didn't like MM:BN's particular formula), and changing that from an RPG to a platformer (sort of the reverse of the X series when they made Command Mission) made it something I could get into. X-Play ragged on it for not having different-enough areas - obviously they didn't play very far into it.
I noticed that this art book has some stuff from Mega Man X: Command Mission, so it's good to see that it wasn't missed out. I wonder if it has art from some of the other spin-offs of Mega Man, like the Game Boy games (especially V), Soccer, Battle & Chase, and all those other ones we talked about in the other Mega Man topic. Oooh, maybe art from Powered Up would be cool, too. X has spin-offs as well, the Mega Man Xtreme games on the Game Boy Color, though I'm not sure how much they'd have that would be new that isn't already covered in the main X series, or that anyone would care about what little is specific to that series...
Post by: Rew on March 30, 2008, 02:17:25 pm
As for Mega Man Soccer, Battle & Chase, Powered Up, or Maverick Hunter X, I have no idea.
---
"So this is what it's like..."
- Spark Mandrill
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 30, 2008, 04:04:04 pm
---
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Current projects: Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man V (GB), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: marioman on March 30, 2008, 04:12:48 pm
I can't remember where I saw the note about the English version of R20, but I think that it was on the Mega Man Network boards. I'll let you know if I find it.
Post by: Ryan Ferneau on May 17, 2008, 10:11:45 pm
I consider Mega Man & Bass to be Mega Man 9 as much as I consider Sonic & Knuckles to be Sonic 4. They are more side-quests than an actual sequels.
Actually, many people consider Sonic and Knuckles to be the second half of Sonic the Hedgehog 3, meaning it was made up of levels that were supposed to be in Sonic the Hedgehog 3 but weren't finished in time for release. So the link-up cartridge was made to be able to preserve some of the original intent.JonLeung Said:
True, making something an RPG doesn't necessarily make things better. But it was a nice change of pace for the Mega Man X series, though, and sometimes that's what's needed.
Hopefully Sonic Chronicles can do the same thing for that series!TerraEsperZ Said:
Anyway, I'm glad to report that thanks to reading Nintendo Power at the time, I knew that X came out before VII and thus calling X ten never even came into question.
Unless you think the series is allowed to jump ahead a few numbers like Star Wars!JonLeung Said:
Anyway, back on topic...I remember Keiji Inafune (I think that's his name) mentioning on that one G4 clip I saw on Mega Man X Anniversary Collection (GameCube version) how if someone presented art of the same quality of the art that he himself had done for the first Mega Man, he would've said, "nope, sorry, try again".
"What, you just painted MegaRockMan red and white and stuck a pair of shears on his head? That's not creative! That's not a good robot design! Get out!"Rew Said:
Still, I hear that there's all sorts of valuable storyline info about MM canon in these type books that we English-speaking folk don't see unless we happen to be on a MM forum with an uber MM nerd who knows Japanese and has these kinds of sourcebooks to cite in debate threads. =P
Yeah, that reminds me of someone who used to hang out on my favorite IRC channel. She was one of those "Japanophile" types who had obviously read all that rare Japanese information about MegaMan and was always ready to correct people who misunderstood the series and offer up facts about Rock's Buster firing solar energy and GravityMan hiding from his officemates on the ceiling... and I'm like, "Huh? How do you know this?" Also, she seemed to have some beef with Mandi Paugh having such a popular site based on a snarky interpretation of the localized games which features inaccurate fanfiction that DARES to incorporate Captain N. But now I'm rambling and gossiping, so I'll stop here
Post by: marioman on May 18, 2008, 05:25:54 am
Post by: JonLeung on September 26, 2008, 04:33:18 pm
And now the artbook's not complete...
Post by: Rew on September 26, 2008, 08:54:23 pm
Also, @Ryan:
As much as I love Mandi Paugh and her MMHP, I just couldn't ever get into her fanfics with Captain N, Link, and other such folks. It just felt...wrong, for some reason. =P
I'd love to see what she could do with a "pure" Mega Man fanfic, though (especially in light of all the criticisms she has of Capcom's way of handling the plots in the classic and X games ;0).
---
"So this is what it's like..."
- Spark Mandrill
Post by: Rew on September 26, 2008, 08:54:45 pm
Also, @Ryan:
As much as I love Mandi Paugh and her MMHP, I just couldn't ever get into her fanfics with Captain N, Link, and other such folks. It just felt...wrong, for some reason. =P
I'd love to see what she could do with a "pure" Mega Man fanfic, though (especially in light of all the criticisms she has of Capcom's way of handling the plots in the classic and X games ;0).
---
"So this is what it's like..."
- Spark Mandrill
Post by: TerraEsperZ on September 26, 2008, 10:57:05 pm
I still can't get over her making Mega Man and Break Man (I wish she wasn't using that name instead of Proto Man) living machines while every other robot is a faceless, soulless automaton (even Roll barely does anything).
---
Current projects: Metal Storm (NES), Clock Tower (SNES), Ristar-The Shooting Star (Gen), Sonic The Hedgehog (Gen), Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES), Bucky O'Hare (NES)
Post by: JonLeung on September 26, 2008, 11:21:00 pm
Post by: Rew on September 27, 2008, 06:30:04 pm
(What did happen, BTW, if you don't mind my asking?)
---
"So this is what it's like..."
- Spark Mandrill
Post by: TerraEsperZ on September 28, 2008, 12:31:18 am
---
Current projects: Metal Storm (NES), Clock Tower (SNES), Ristar-The Shooting Star (Gen), Sonic The Hedgehog (Gen), Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES), Bucky O'Hare (NES)
Post by: Rew on September 28, 2008, 10:06:54 am
Little tidbits like that make the OCD in Rew very happy. =D
---
"So this is what it's like..."
- Spark Mandrill
Post by: TerraEsperZ on November 15, 2008, 05:49:51 pm
As an aside, I need to point out that I just receive my copy of Mega Man Zero Complete Works :D!!! I actually had to order the sucker twice since the mailman, being unable to deliver the package to me in person (because, would you believe, I actually *work* during the day?), sent the package back to Amazon with the mention "Undeliverable", which is total bullshit because every previous package from Amazon was simply left at the local post office instead. Thank you Canada Post >:(
---
Current projects: Bucky O'Hare (NES), Metal Storm (NES), Clock Tower (SNES), Ristar-The Shooting Star (Gen), Sonic The Hedgehog (Gen), Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: marioman on March 30, 2009, 07:46:35 am
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 30, 2009, 09:11:27 am
---
Current projects: Bucky O'Hare (NES), Metal Storm (NES), Clock Tower (SNES), Ristar-The Shooting Star (Gen), Sonic The Hedgehog (Gen), Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: JonLeung on March 30, 2009, 11:38:14 am
Post by: TerraEsperZ on March 30, 2009, 08:41:02 pm
---
Current projects: Bucky O'Hare (NES), Metal Storm (NES), Clock Tower (SNES), Ristar-The Shooting Star (Gen), Sonic The Hedgehog (Gen), Sonic CD (Sega CD), Mega Man Zero (GBA), Battletoads (NES)
Post by: JonLeung on March 30, 2009, 09:56:37 pm
The fourth (but final) part was handed over to a different artist, who not only drew closer to Capcom-style, but also drew in cameos of two other Capcom characters and several "real" Robot Masters, and luckily that didn't include any of the school or Rocky-alter-ego stuff. Would have been nice if that set the standard for the series if it wasn't known it was the end. Even if Dreamwave hadn't gone bankrupt, a epilogue and cliffhanger that ties directly into the Mega Man X probably would've ended the non-X series.
(I never did get around to watching the last episode of the Ruby-Spears Mega Man cartoon but I know they also brought in visitors from the future, ie. the Mega Man X series. It's like they were both eager to tie Mega Man to Mega Man X right before it all ended.)
Ah, but I said a full review of the comic should come later. So I will save the details for later.
Post by: JonLeung on April 25, 2009, 06:56:19 am
Anyway, looks like we have the covers of the artbooks now, courtesy of UDON's recent blogpost.
Funny, of all the images they could've used for Mega Man, the main one is the same one I used back when I featured the Mega Man games as a front-page feature...
(I think Zero's creator (you know who I speak of) appears a bit too prominently on the Mega Man X cover. He even thrusts his name/logo out there. Isn't the mere reference of him supposed to be a spoiler from Mega Man X 4? Also, X appears at least twice on the cover of the original Mega Man's book.)
Post by: JonLeung on January 08, 2010, 07:55:35 am
Looking back on earlier posts in this topic is funny, like when I asked where Mega Man 9 was (in reference to Mega Man X not being Mega Man 10), since that was before we'd even heard of Mega Man 9. And now, Mega Man 10 (not X) is upon us.
But how I actually found this topic again a couple minutes ago was that I was looking up (on a whim), "Game Boy is two words" in Google, where this topic comes up as one of the few results, and unfortunately brings my grievous error up, where I said earlier that I would slap anyone who thinks it's two words, when I meant to say that I would slap anyone who thinks it's one word. :P
Post by: Rew on January 08, 2010, 08:08:19 pm
Post by: TerraEsperZ on January 09, 2010, 12:29:01 am
Post by: JonLeung on January 13, 2010, 09:31:12 pm
It'll take me some time to properly go through these. I did notice a bunch of sketches near the middle of the Mega Man Offical Complete Works book (page 118 and 119) of Robot Masters that weren't used for Mega Man II, and though many were just evolutionary steps to the finalized Robot Masters we're familiar with, many of them really could pass as Robot Masters as they are. It's funny to see that their names go through changes, too, and there are some names and designs that would appear in later games.
On the road to Bubble Man, there's a design called Pump Man (the name of a Robot Master in the upcoming Mega Man 10), several Water Men including a fishy one that looks like Neptune (from the Game Boy Mega Man V), and it looks like Bubble Man himself was also almost called Water Man, a name strangely not used yet. Before Air Man is a prototype Wind Man, who looks like Elec Man and nothing at all like his Mega Man 6 namesake. Metal Man could have been called Rolling Man, and strangely enough, a previous version of him actually has his finalized name. Wood Man is grouped together with a bunch of animal "Men", including Hornet Man, a name used in Mega Man 9. Crash Man could've been named Missile Man, and his previous form was called Drill Man, who actually looks close to the Mega Man IV version. Heat Man resembles a lighter, but his precursor is Smoke Man, who has a cigarette in his mouth; I'm not too sure that would go over well in America considering Capcom themselves didn't like Wesker smoking in the live-action opening of the already M-rated Resident Evil for the PlayStation. :P There's also a silly coloured sketch of a red guy with a magnet on his head who is unused, but bears a resemblance to Magnet Man in Mega Man III. And wow, all that interesting stuff on just two pages. Four pages later, there are tons of unused Robot Master designs, most don't have names, unfortunately. Of the few named ones, Vacuum Man looks a lot like Pump Man from the first page I mentioned.
And of course all the official finalized artwork is amazing. They also have box art; somehow they have an entire page for each of the first two European boxes, and while they also have the American Mega Man II/2, they seem to have deliberately omitted the American box art for the first game. :P Unless I missed it...
Post by: JonLeung on August 15, 2010, 08:42:21 am
http://gonintendo.com/viewstory.php?id=133268 (http://gonintendo.com/viewstory.php?id=133268)